So, inspired by a comment in topic 69:
"...if I remember correctly, the ultimate immune Pagnokras in four elements did require Fire. Maybe that was Petoskolki or Lunarcit..."
I've been mucking around in Excel and Mathematica, working in 15-dimensional vector space, etcetera, and assuming I haven't just made terrible mistakes, the lower bound for fewest number of elements needed for no weakness is 6, at the moment. Upper bound 15, because I just added them all together and there were no weaknesses. There's also about ten excess 'Strong Againsts' in the system. Seogrim has six of them.
P.S. Also, the closest, working from the bottom, has been Chaos&Light, strong against Crystal and Majyck, very weak to Psychic. So if there's a 'Balance' Monster in there somewhere, he turns out to be appropriately inert, till you get in his head.
[Edited by Dragon_Kirby on Jun 3, 2012 1:14]
Jun 3, 2012 16:51
Not really surprised that the super-combination monster has more resistance than weakness. Elements are designed to have a balance and then they also resist themselves, thus there is more resistance in the grid than there is super-effectiveness.
Of course, the Christmas contest extra-element only lets you set one additional element. The other ones, if not native, you have to try to gain by something that may very well be harder to do than level-up an Elder: gain an additional element. I think most people's only hope is on their General since they make a habit never to die.
Also, it is nice that six elements are needed for No Weak, but what is the fewest number of additional elements needed on top of an already existing monster (my guess, Seogrim) to get No Weak?
"Don't judge me by my actions. Judge me by how I tell you I am inside." ~ Colin Quinn
Jun 3, 2012 19:57
Yeah, they all resisted themselves. It was also interesting to find that it wasn't (anti)symmetric, i.e, A is weak to B doesn't imply B is strong against A. Funny thing about Seogrim though, while Crystal and Earth both have three more strengths than weaknesses, you waste three of the six double resisting Crystal, Earth, and Fire; which isn't so bad, but the weaknesses to Nature and Astral, in particular, are hard to cover...
Ah, and, so far, the lower bound is 6 just cuz my Mathematica code is very inelegant, so checking six element combinations will take at least fifteen times as long as five...I'm trying to get it to ignore all the repeated permutations...
Double also; I went back to check something, and I lied about Chaos and light, that's just the two element combination with only one -double- weakness; there are more mundane combinations with just one single weakness, Like Majyck and Psychic, which I'm like 93% sure isn't available/possible presently; The only weakness is Mecha, which I think only Nygultro2 and 3 have in their patterns? And another which is actually possible, so I might try it out.