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Forums :: Reality's End Classic :: Some cool pictures

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TheAnaconda

Posts: 57
Member #15

Mar 14, 2002 22:38
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  Since pokemon sites are dwindling with every passing day, not many people get the opportunity to see cool new stuff when it comes out.
  
  Well, what I have here is pretty cool... it's some screenshots of Pokemon Advanced. If you haven't seen them, check these out!
  
  (they don't show any pokemon battles just general gameplay)
  
  http://www.pokemonaaah.com/5-vid/16-advance/screenshots.shtml
  
  ...Hmm.. Member #18... posts:18... Hm...
  
  
  [Editted by TheAnaconda on Mar 15, 2002 4:40]
MadGoblin

Posts: 1515
Member #2

Mar 15, 2002 6:19
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  Yeah, most of these have been seen. There are a lot of sites with these, it's just finding the good one's that's hard. As need as those are, here's some early released pics o' some of the new pokes. Find them here.
  
  Looks like we're gonna have a new bone-ghosty poke! Yay!
Ryuujin

Posts: 176
Member #11

Mar 15, 2002 10:08
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  Hmpf... it's still not 3D, you can't kill stuff in it, and the creatures don't get wounded/bleed - BORING ^_^
MintMan

Posts: 4061
Member #1

Mar 15, 2002 19:42
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  I guess I'm a back-lash from the g'd ol' days of gaming when things didn't have to be 3-D. Actually, I prefer it. I'd rather have servicable 2-D graphics than sucky (and they usually are) 3-D ones.
  I just have a few hopes for the new Pokemon game:
  1) Put OHKOs back to being Speed based instead of Level based. That really upset the balance...
  2) Make the freakin' Thick Club less powerful! Marowak became popular, thus not allowing me to use him any more.
  3) Less Legendaries! I hope those two new water freaks are the only new Legendaries in the game; it's bad enough someone can make a team of all Legendaries right now as it is; I don't want them to get a lot of choice in the matter, too.
  Gee, with all of this Advanced buzz, it gets ya thinkin' about the GS RE League and how I'm going to have to hurry up on it...
  
  *snores*
  *wakes up*

  
  Oh yeah, I have important work to get to!
  ... hmmm, killing Pokemon, eh?
Ryuujin

Posts: 176
Member #11

Mar 16, 2002 9:20
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  In the past 3D graphics have been easily outmatched by 2D - but they're just starting to clear that hurdle now - if you've played Black and White you'll understand, rendering methods have become very advanced now and you can do some impressive stuff that 2-D just can't match.
  
  ...anyway, if they want me to play POkémon they'll need to atke some tips from Black and White...
  
  ...in B&W you care for a creature, you teach it how to behave, how to use magic, what it should do, eat, etc. - it can't "die", but in fights it gets wounded, scarred, slashed and bleeds (and faints)- the battles are real-time, unlike Pokémon, but you still tell the creature roughly what you want it to do. In Pokémon their attacks look shyt - even in Stadium (they could have done some very cool things, but they choose wussy easy-to-code)
  
  I reckon Pokémon should get some hints from their style of gameplay, it's far more interesting and immersive, potentially Pokémon could be brought into the 21st century, older player community, but they arn't - they're hanging onto their kiddy marketting methods...
  
  
  [Editted by Ryuujin on Mar 16, 2002 15:22]
MintMan

Posts: 4061
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Mar 16, 2002 19:48
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  That is all due to Pokemon being a throwback from old school RPGs. Back in the day, a flickering graphic would be all that was needed to symbolize an attack; Pokemon uses much the same ideology. That's why it has the option to turn off animation. That's why the GSBot was able to become so popular. Pokemon is more of a thinking, fight-against-other-people game. Chess is no less fun because you don't see the pieces kill one another.
  And I think the lack of animations for Pokemon is more than reasonable. They now have 351 Pokemon to make graphics for, not to mention all of the new attacks which God and the nerds at Nintendo only know how many there shall be now. The RBY count of attacks was -- what -- two hundred something? In two more series of games, that number has only increased, and 351 multiplied by anything over that old two hundred spells bad mojo. I don't even know if it is feasible to cram that all into one game.
  Then the real-time issue again. I don't see how real-time makes an RPG any better. To me, it just makes it different. RPGs weren't made to be real time. That's why RPGs were made in the first place -- for sitting still and doing nothing, attacking in sequence. It isn't supposed to be a realistic battle, but a simulated one -- a fact which modern RPGs seem to be drifting away from.
  And I never said that 2-D was better than 3-D; I said that it usually is. Sure, we can have 3-D graphics that are far better than 2-D. Hel, that's been true for -- get this -- over twenty years now. We've always been able to make those graphics (I read a book! Teehee!). The problems come in with 1) memory constraint and 2) making them look good. Sure, B&W can make some sweet stuff, but the artistic crew from it isn't everywhere. If all graphics could be made as well as FF cut-scene quality, then there would be no competition in the 2-D field, yet most people can't even fathom something that good and instead we get wads of suck that look like Wild ARMs battle graphics (they shoulda just kept it 2-D like the rest of the game).
Ryuujin

Posts: 176
Member #11

Mar 17, 2002 7:35
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  *Sniggers at Star Fox or whatever it was called back on the SNES*
  
  I know - I like games that require thought, but a bit of eye candy is nice...
  
  Anyway - onto logistics...
  It's not quite as hard as programming 200 attacks.
  You create a database, with an entry for each attack, each attack then putting together several prefab graphics (this is what Stadium does already - but to a less impressive extent BTW) - prefab graphics being such as a cone of snow particles, a beam of energy, fireball on impact point, heavy dust cloud projection after impact, that kind of thing.
  
  The generating the massive number of attacks ain't too hard - now animating is a bigger issue, and admitantly a hard one to crack, with the Pokémod I calculated for a realistic looking Pokémon you'd need a lot aniamtions.
  
  Animations:
  Breathing, faint, hurt (weak), hurt (bad) hurt (critical), attack (arms) attack (legs), attack (special), attack (body blow), defensive posture + if you wanted to add some coolness you'd need strafe left/right, move forward, move back)
  
  Now with the size of production team Nintendo has this wouldn't be too hard to accomplish - but instead, Nintendo only used like 6 animations per model...
  
  ...when I said "to add some coolness" - if Nintendo had been clever they could have taken some tips from Monster Rancher, so that when a creature dodges an attack (attack missed) it moves several degrees in a direction in the arena (strafe) so that the creatures don't just stand facing each other, but activly move around the arena as the fight progresses - while still not fully allowing a "tell him to move around" setup.
  
  ...anyway, no point me ranting, Nintendo would never be nearly as imaginate as to do soemthing like that...
MadGoblin

Posts: 1515
Member #2

Mar 18, 2002 7:12
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  Ah, yes. Monster Rancher does rule, but you have to remember something:
  MR (even in its latest edition) still probably sports less than 50 actual monsters (the majority of them being the same frames with different skins over and over again) while Game Freaks could recycle very few of its frames.
  
  That's why they should do what everyone wants them to do: Kill off all of the sucky, unloved pokemon!!!(hey, MR did it, and nobody misses them at all!) They pretty much did that in the first PKMN Stadium game (which never made it out here) since not all pokes could be found in it. But, seriously, they could just cut out half at bat (any unevolved) and then the ugly ones ^_^, thus leaving us with somewhere around 100 to 125? I'd be fine with that! I mean, it's not like anyone ever uses Magcargo or Dunsparce anyways, right?
Ryuujin

Posts: 176
Member #11

Mar 18, 2002 11:04
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  Yeah - that's why Nintendo wasn't thinking straight when they made Pokémon, they wern't thinking logisticly....
  
  Monster rancher is not just clever for using the same models with different skins - but they managed to tie that into the gameplay (that you can create new sub-species of a creature by mixing their gene pool) - now if the guy who made Pokémon had thought of that, he could have made the whole thing much cooler, instead of having to cheapskate the graphics in order to wage war on the ever popular Digimon (who contantly invents new creatures with every episode)...
  
  ...shame really - MR had some pretty good concepts in it, but from the version I played the gameplay is very limited (training, and big match battles for cash)
  
  
  [Editted by Ryuujin on Mar 18, 2002 17:07]
TheAnaconda

Posts: 57
Member #15

Mar 19, 2002 15:19
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  Umm... since when did Nintendo per say accually make Pokemon? Last time I checked, it said GameFreak on the game... A licenced independant developer. Aaaand, they still are the ones developing it, not(!) Nintendo itself...(as by the fact that it says, once translated, "We are currently in the stages of developing pokemon advanced" on the GameFreak webpage)
  
  (IWeI?)
  
  Edit: Wrong coding for tags(stupid UBBCode)
  
  [Editted by TheAnaconda on Mar 19, 2002 21:23]
Camo

Posts: 1609
Member #5

Mar 19, 2002 15:46
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  Pokemon Advance looks pretty nice, and this is coming from someone who isn't really into pokemon, If I ever get a gameboy advance, I think I'd grab that game.
  And Nintendo say they own everything....
  Finally got my hands on Phantasy Star 2 (cannot find number 1 anyewere) and must agree its a f***ing challenging game! All I have done is got the recorder of mother brain and I just got that jetscooter thing, its cool but cannot find anything special with it!
I am lord of the lair my lair

  Owner of the Happy gym

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